Thoughts have no value until you give it to them?

[pljames]

  Do I now understand that thoughts are of no value until you give then value? Like love hate kill rape and such? I am beginning to understand external and internal circumstances create us to believe what our thoughts mean. But our thoughts are meaningless unto we create a meaning and believe them? pljames

[pljames]

Can anyone attempt to answer this question? Feedback please? pljames

[SWM]

love, hate, kill, rape are not thoughts per se, a thought as we commonly think of them can be language based, ie self talk. examples inlcude.
"i want to kill that chicken"
"nobody loves me"
"i want to rape that hedge hog"
"i am disturbed"
"i hate myself"
these are thoughts. they are langauge based and are a phantom of your brains functioning.

when thinking about thoughts we would also include mental images and memories.

the memory of the last time you ate chicken. your fantasy of having sex with a hedgehog.

memories inlude images and we embelish them with self talk. ie memory of eating chicken, picture self pulling leg off steaming hot cooked chicken, "that chicken was so good, i fancy some chicken"

thoughts are like the weather they come and go, they pass and are done, like the rain, snow or sun.  like the weather they are the result of changing pressures in the environment. thoughts arise in the mind due to the eperience we are having, language based thoughts are the langauge centres in your brain verbalising the experienced perceptions of your brain. your experienced perceptions will also include your memories and the created images of the future. and your language based thoughts will get involved in describing and emblishing these for you.

when you ask do they have any value, we would need to establish how you as an individual would measure value. if the thoughts were enhancing to your biologial organism would that be valuable, if they were enhancing your emotional experience but to the detriment of your biological organism would that be valuable to you.

so your thoughts might currently have positive or negative value if your thoughts are working for you in some way.

there is also a possibility that what you are asking about is external value, if so you would need to explain what you mean by love hate, kill, rape in the original question.  as these are not thoughts per se.

[SWM]

did you ever listen to the space between your thoughts. sometimes your thoughts are a cascade of self talk, images and memories that run and roll on and on.

it is very intersting to step out of that cascade and pay attention as an observer,         watchin for the space     between the thoughts.   

notice the space       between      each       thought.                    start to pay attention to the space              between the thoughts.


 
the more attention you pay to the space         the more of the space            you will notice.     


this will give you a perspective for evaluating your thoughts which is better than when you were in the cascade of thoughts.

[pljames]

Thoughts to me are (?) words that come to my mind and I cannot see them, I just know/believe they are there (problem there to). When I write them down I now see them and understand what they mean only when seen. Thoughts plus ideas are words I can't see but Know(?) they are there. Be it memory thoughts whatever when the thought occurs it has no value(meaning definition love hate).

But If I give it meaning/definition love hate then it becomes alive has value and is something important to me. It stands out from the other thoughts memories for me to remember. Maybe the word (alive) is the wrong word but I can't find a appropiate word to use. Thoughts please? pl

love, hate, kill, rape are not thoughts per se, a thought as we commonly think of them can be language based, ie self talk. examples inlcude.
"i want to kill that chicken"
"nobody loves me"
"i want to rape that hedge hog"
"i am disturbed"
"i hate myself"
these are thoughts. they are langauge based and are a phantom of your brains functioning.

when thinking about thoughts we would also include mental images and memories.

the memory of the last time you ate chicken. your fantasy of having sex with a hedgehog.

memories inlude images and we embelish them with self talk. ie memory of eating chicken, picture self pulling leg off steaming hot cooked chicken, "that chicken was so good, i fancy some chicken"

thoughts are like the weather they come and go, they pass and are done, like the rain, snow or sun.  like the weather they are the result of changing pressures in the environment. thoughts arise in the mind due to the eperience we are having, language based thoughts are the langauge centres in your brain verbalising the experienced perceptions of your brain. your experienced perceptions will also include your memories and the created images of the future. and your language based thoughts will get involved in describing and emblishing these for you.

when you ask do they have any value, we would need to establish how you as an individual would measure value. if the thoughts were enhancing to your biologial organism would that be valuable, if they were enhancing your emotional experience but to the detriment of your biological organism would that be valuable to you.

so your thoughts might currently have positive or negative value if your thoughts are working for you in some way.

there is also a possibility that what you are asking about is external value, if so you would need to explain what you mean by love hate, kill, rape in the original question.  as these are not thoughts per se.

[SWM]

what can you say about relationship between your thoughts love/ hate and your feelings love / hate? this may take some self reflection.

[Philbert]

it is very intersting to step out of that cascade and pay attention as an observer,         watchin for the space     between the thoughts.

This is most excellent advice.  I would guess many psychological issues can be successfully addressed simply by creating a bit of space between "me" and "my thoughts".   

I'm not sure about the bit about sex with hedgehogs though.  But I don't want to be judgmental, as I haven't tried it myself.  None of them will have me....  :-(

[pljames]

what can you say about relationship between your thoughts love/ hate and your feelings love / hate? this may take some self reflection.

Love and hate are just thoughts when they come to mind, but I know what they mean and that gives me value to add to them. The relationship between love and hate are degrees. Feeling love has a greater emotional impact than just the thought. I am still evaluating the difference between emotions from the heart than the mind. pl

[Alexandre]

What comes first, the emotion or the thought?

I'm having trouble right now. I'm thinking about a person who literally nauseates me... Now what came first, the thought or the emotion? I don't know. The feeling may have come as an ugly precursor, as if to lay the groundwork for the thought, or perhaps the thought came first and I then became disgusted?

I don't want to give these negative thoughts meaning, but I cannot withstand the pressure. And if there indeed is pressure, what could the repercussions of this said pressure be?

Pljames Do you think that we can consciously choose which thoughts to assign meaning to and which thoughts to discard or dismiss?

[pljames]

  To me the thought comes first (without emotion). Then because of the outside stimuli, you give value to the thought and it is no longer just a thought it now is a emotion. We can dismiss a thought at will or create a emotion from our past present circumstances. Because of our senses at will we can also create emotion. But I feel it's a thought first (which we can change at will before it's a emotion. pljames (excellent question).

[SWM]

What comes first, the emotion or the thought?

I'm having trouble right now. I'm thinking about a person who literally nauseates me... Now what came first, the thought or the emotion? I don't know. The feeling may have come as an ugly precursor, as if to lay the groundwork for the thought, or perhaps the thought came first and I then became disgusted?

I don't want to give these negative thoughts meaning, but I cannot withstand the pressure. And if there indeed is pressure, what could the repercussions of this said pressure be?

Pljames Do you think that we can consciously choose which thoughts to assign meaning to and which thoughts to discard or dismiss?

first was a physiological experience which is something like an emotion but not quite. this physiological experience is your perception of the world and your perception of self distributed through your sense organs to your central nervous system (brain). the brain then collates this information and opens it to consciousness in the form of mental dialogue, images or memories. these are what we commonly call thoughts. your central nervous system (brain) will perceive the images memories and mental dialogue and react to them in a similar way it reacts to external sense perceptions. 

i will have to come back to this, as i dont have time to finish it.

[pljames]

Alexande
What about a thought already with the emotion? And add insult to injury what about memory? Was it a memory+thought or thought+emotionor all three in one thought? pl

What comes first, the emotion or the thought?

I'm having trouble right now. I'm thinking about a person who literally nauseates me... Now what came first, the thought or the emotion? I don't know. The feeling may have come as an ugly precursor, as if to lay the groundwork for the thought, or perhaps the thought came first and I then became disgusted?

I don't want to give these negative thoughts meaning, but I cannot withstand the pressure. And if there indeed is pressure, what could the repercussions of this said pressure be?

Pljames Do you think that we can consciously choose which thoughts to assign meaning to and which thoughts to discard or dismiss?

[pljames]

SWM,
 To me love hate kill rape are negative thoughts and maybe memory thoughts but not just nothing thoughts. Could these thoughts be from memory? pl

love, hate, kill, rape are not thoughts per se, a thought as we commonly think of them can be language based, ie self talk. examples inlcude.
"i want to kill that chicken"
"nobody loves me"
"i want to rape that hedge hog"
"i am disturbed"
"i hate myself"
these are thoughts. they are langauge based and are a phantom of your brains functioning.

when thinking about thoughts we would also include mental images and memories.

the memory of the last time you ate chicken. your fantasy of having sex with a hedgehog.

memories inlude images and we embelish them with self talk. ie memory of eating chicken, picture self pulling leg off steaming hot cooked chicken, "that chicken was so good, i fancy some chicken"

thoughts are like the weather they come and go, they pass and are done, like the rain, snow or sun.  like the weather they are the result of changing pressures in the environment. thoughts arise in the mind due to the eperience we are having, language based thoughts are the langauge centres in your brain verbalising the experienced perceptions of your brain. your experienced perceptions will also include your memories and the created images of the future. and your language based thoughts will get involved in describing and emblishing these for you.

when you ask do they have any value, we would need to establish how you as an individual would measure value. if the thoughts were enhancing to your biologial organism would that be valuable, if they were enhancing your emotional experience but to the detriment of your biological organism would that be valuable to you.

so your thoughts might currently have positive or negative value if your thoughts are working for you in some way.

there is also a possibility that what you are asking about is external value, if so you would need to explain what you mean by love hate, kill, rape in the original question.  as these are not thoughts per se.

[pljames]

Yes I believe we can assign meaning to whatever thought we wish or not. But the emotional ones are the hardest to say no to. do we not choose postive or negative thoughts? pl

What comes first, the emotion or the thought?

I'm having trouble right now. I'm thinking about a person who literally nauseates me... Now what came first, the thought or the emotion? I don't know. The feeling may have come as an ugly precursor, as if to lay the groundwork for the thought, or perhaps the thought came first and I then became disgusted?

I don't want to give these negative thoughts meaning, but I cannot withstand the pressure. And if there indeed is pressure, what could the repercussions of this said pressure be?

Pljames Do you think that we can consciously choose which thoughts to assign meaning to and which thoughts to discard or dismiss?

[Alexandre]

We do not choose thoughts. I believe we can't control that stage in this process. But we can choose actions(to a degree) and those actions can result in positive or negative thoughts. Attitude is everything. Some people are smart/lucky enough to have cultivated a positive attitude. For those people negativity is a challenge. Optimism vs pessimism, it's the attitude of a person that decides whether a thought has value or has negative value or has positive value.

[pljames]

SWM,
 Why can't thoughts be memory/ies. We are bombarded from birth with words pictures and experiences. They all are put into memory storage. If a word comes to mind then it has to be a word as a thought memory? pl

love, hate, kill, rape are not thoughts per se, a thought as we commonly think of them can be language based, ie self talk. examples inlcude.
"i want to kill that chicken"
"nobody loves me"
"i want to rape that hedge hog"
"i am disturbed"
"i hate myself"
these are thoughts. they are langauge based and are a phantom of your brains functioning.

when thinking about thoughts we would also include mental images and memories.

the memory of the last time you ate chicken. your fantasy of having sex with a hedgehog.

memories inlude images and we embelish them with self talk. ie memory of eating chicken, picture self pulling leg off steaming hot cooked chicken, "that chicken was so good, i fancy some chicken"

thoughts are like the weather they come and go, they pass and are done, like the rain, snow or sun.  like the weather they are the result of changing pressures in the environment. thoughts arise in the mind due to the eperience we are having, language based thoughts are the langauge centres in your brain verbalising the experienced perceptions of your brain. your experienced perceptions will also include your memories and the created images of the future. and your language based thoughts will get involved in describing and emblishing these for you.

when you ask do they have any value, we would need to establish how you as an individual would measure value. if the thoughts were enhancing to your biologial organism would that be valuable, if they were enhancing your emotional experience but to the detriment of your biological organism would that be valuable to you.

so your thoughts might currently have positive or negative value if your thoughts are working for you in some way.

there is also a possibility that what you are asking about is external value, if so you would need to explain what you mean by love hate, kill, rape in the original question.  as these are not thoughts per se.