12yo boy at school

[soliro]

Hello, I am in school admin and was asked to bring a 12yo boy from class to office today because he was not cooperating with the teacher, kept crying and disrupting the class and even neighboring classes.  We are a small religious school and do not have counselors or even a nurse.  I got him out of the class with help from another teacher, talking and tugging him along.

The boy and I did not make it all the way to the office right away because he was crying too much, so we sat for a while waiting for him to calm down.  I found out from him that he is "in trouble" for not doing his homework (for the 6th time this year) because he "forgot the notebook in class" and he doesn't want the teacher or principal to call his parents because they "take stuff away" (toys and video games) whenever he gets in trouble. I tried to give him some hope by saying that there is a way to work this out but he'll have to work hard and face and resolve his problems. When he calmed down somewhat, I got him to wash his face, brought him to the office, and, even though it is none of my business, not my profession, and against my best judgment, spoke about the boy to the principal before the boy was to go in.

 The principal was prepared to go hard on the boy, call up his parents and get the same process started that I saw happening many times before with this particular boy. The process involves talking to parents in person, asking them to get professional counseling for their child, (which they refuse to do), a lot of crying and promises, and has gotten the school and the family nowhere in the last school year when I witnessed the boy regularly getting in trouble for "forgetting homework."

I told the principal that the process is not working, to which he readily agreed.  He then charged me with coming up with a different strategy (since I was “volunteering” by sticking my head in). I improvised on the spot by coming up with an “action plan” idea that I must have read about somewhere before.  Basically, the boy will have to come up with his own action plan to solve his own problems.  I would discuss it with him and then have him write it all down, make it official and work on it.  We would also involve the parents, but not before having a clear idea of what we want to ask them to do, because notifying them just to have them “take stuff away” is pointless. The boy would not go back to class until his action plan is ready and in effect and also because the teacher was not able to handle the situation on her own, at least that day.  The principal gave me the go-ahead.

So I went ahead and told the boy that he will not speak to the principal and his parents won’t get a phone call yet, but he will have to work hard to solve the problem and prevent it from happening again. I asked his opinion on what his problem is, why he has that problem, what he can do to fix it, what step by step actions he can take and whom he can ask for what sorts of help.  He said that the problem is that he doesn’t do his homework, it exists because he forgets, he believes his memory to be bad, and he’ll solve this by not forgetting anymore.  He’d like some help, but isn’t sure what sort and from where it might come. I suggested that he come up with a routine for packing his backpack, and he said that he can do that.  I got him to start typing it up, and here’s what we have so far:
_________________________________________
My problem is that sometimes I forget my homework and sometimes I forget my text book. i try my best but it just happens. I had my teacher
I will from now on do my homework and do my best not to fail any test and to ever forget my homework, and this is how I’m going to do it.
Step1 Pack up all my homework and my text books if I Have tests.
Step2 As soon as I get home I Will start my homework and make sure it is finished.
Step 3 As soon as I get to school I Will make sure that I have all my homework
In conclusion I am truly sorry that I disrupted t
______________________
At this point, the school day has ended and I had to send him to pack up and get on the school bus.  I told him that he is responsible for today’s hw, and that tomorrow morning we’ll continue working on the action plan.

After dismissal, I invited the teacher to discuss the situation in the principal’s office.  The teacher was very upset with the boy for consistently not doing hw, and said that although it was class policy that on the third missing hw the child would get a call home from the teacher, she has given the boy several extensions already, and was all set to go through with it this time regardless of crying.  I let her know that this situation has happened before, and the principal confirmed that this has been going on for the 5 years that the child has been enrolled. The principal suspects that the parents do not have time to properly supervise their child, or create routines or schedules for him.  Last year, the boy frequently nodded off in class because he played video games through the night.

I explained to the teacher that we are trying something new this time and gave her what details I had at that point.  We found out that the boy has lied-he told the teacher that he forgot the notebook at home, and he told me that he forgot his notebook in class.  The principal confirmed that the boy is known for lying. On the bright side, the teacher gave him a positive characteristic in all other matters. He is apparently a smart child, reasonably obedient, does his classwork, tests well and cannot be faulted for his academics or behavior except for the homework problem. She has come up with the idea of having the parents sign for hw completion in the student planner where hw assignments are recorded. She will also work hard to provide extra supervision to the boy.  The principal has suggested that she may have the boy complete missing hw assignments in class, between other classwork. The teacher neither agreed nor commited to this idea, as it may be difficult to implement.

I told her that I will work with the boy on the action plan tomorrow and will prepare a letter and a verbal statement for parents.  I am thinking to have the boy expand the detail on bag packing routines, one for school, one for home, work out a schedule that will include a specific hw time and that will work the same every day but have some flexibility for unforeseen events.  I will inform the boy that we will have to work with his teacher and parents to implement everything in his plan.

For the parents, I’ll ask them to come up with a routine day’s schedule and help the boy stick to it, providing close supervision in terms of checking every day what assignments he has, what he has completed, whether the work has any mistakes, and checking that everything gets packed in the backpack, and the backpack is always in the same place.  These parental duties should be done each evening, not in the morning right before school, and not just spot checking some evenings, but every evening for a long time, possibly until he graduates school. If they cannot provide this much attention to their child, then they should either a) accept professional counseling right away, possibly for the whole family and not just the boy, b) resign themselves to the fact that the boy will not be able to resolve this on his own and will continue getting in trouble regularly, or c) transfer to a public school which might have other means of helping the family. I will provide sample day schedules, show them the boy’s action plan, have the teacher discuss and confirm the plan, have the principal discuss and confirm all these actions with them, have them sign the boy’s plan, request that they submit to me/teacher/principal by next Monday a detailed day schedule for their child, and request their commitment to work hard on helping the boy every day of every week for a very long time.

I only hope that if this is resolved, I do not become school counselor. God forbid.

Please help me understand whether I am doing the right thing here. Should I proceed the same, change approach, or somehow disentangle myself from all this? Am I headed straight of a cliff with my action plan ideas?

[soliro]

I see no replies so I don't know if anyone at this forum cares or, being not skilled in advanced psychological therapy, I am missing the point of this whole forum, but here's what happened next:

Today, I took him straight off the school bus, and had him finish his action plan, which included a routine to pack his backpack, a procedure to follow when crying, and a plan to improve relationships with teacher and parents. When I was reasonably satisfied with his plans, that is when they looked clear and doable to me, I gave him a copy of them and asked him to type it or rewrite it neatly over the weekend, adding anything he feels should be added. Then I released him back to class. He did do his hw today and behaved well in class.

I started writing a letter to parents to update them that the boy's problem is ongoing and he now made this action plan, which the school will support and parents should too. In the letter, I asked them to refrain from discussing the problem with the boy until they speak to school and from punishing him until a reasonable system or rewards and punishments is developed. They are to make an appointment to meet with teacher and school admin-myself and principal. They are to be prepared to develop routines/schedules/rules and work hard.

The letter is already a page long, two pages with all the signatures and formalities that will go on it. I'm trying to keep it short and positive.

Come Monday, I'll check what the boy completed over the weekend, have a quick talk with him letting him know that the parents are getting a call and letter as well as the intended content of conversations, finish letter, get it approved with teacher/principal, and call parents.

There, I expect things to go awry. I expect the reaction to be overly emotional and leaning towards anger and retaliation.  I am getting mentally ready to channel that as much as possible towards a firm resolution to do things right, work hard, cooperating with all parties involved.

So far, no one has had any sort of criticism, only a few careful compliments and cautious approvals...

[HeyItsRyan]

There a million and one causes for the boy's behavior.

First of all, no 12 year old should act out like that simply because he thinks his parents might take away his video games. There is an underlying cause for his behavior and if he acts out like that often, be it at home or at school, then he should be taken to a child psychiatrist for treatment.

Forgetfulness isn't the issue. I'm sure that boy's memory is better than yours and mine combined.

A LOT of factors are at play here when it comes to a child who isn't mature enough to express himself emotionally. Instead of rationalizing the situation he lashes out, cries, whines and (more often enough) expresses himself with anger and violence. Next thing you know he's drawing pictures of himself killing his classmates and strangling kittens in the back yard. It sounds like a cliche movie plot, but this is a real thing.

If I were this child's psychiatrist I'd start with the parents, as 80% of the time they're the underlying cause. Are they abusive? Do they yell at him or punish him too much? Is he forced too often to do things against his will? Then I'd ask questions about his teacher and specifically your school.

I personally disagree with medicating children unless it's SEVERELY needed, but this boy might have ADHD and may need to be put on medication to calm him down and help him think.


On to you, the plan you came up with is good, but you're biting off more than you can chew and I would stay out of it. The child is overly emotional and easily overwhelmed, and you don't want to be put into a situation where you'll have to be responsible for his actions.

Let me know if you have any questions.

Good luck.

[S. Earl Martin]

The plan you came up with is similar to mediation. This is used in schools in my area. It deals with positions and interests. When I was in school I would do similar things to this boy, because I was being abused at home and my parants were to busy to notice. Any free time they had was devoted to my brothers and I had to fend for myself. I would do things to have to stay after school because there I was safe and my brothers couldn't torture me. It also forced my parants to listen to me and pay attention to me. They didn't believe I was being abused. My brothers would lie and say I fell or whatever. This boy may have some underlying situation he is afraid to discuss. Or he could just be immature and looking for attention. It is good of you that you care enough to get involved. Another possibility is you might see if he has a friend and can get them to do thier homework together. Also try both positive and negative reenforcement. Be blessed. 

[soliro]

Thank you for your thoughtful reply.

To HeyItsRyan:

I wholeheartedly agree that the boy should be taken to a child psychiatrist.  This has been a standing recommendation from our school to his parents for at least the year that I've been working there.  The parents do not want to hear it.  Of course, we'll keep asking, and I'll make sure to mention it to them first when we meet in person.

As to the boy's reasons, I also doubt that it is forgetfulness. I haven't come out and said so to him, because I think that would be counter productive, but whether it's really forgetfulness or other issues, I had him work out a packing routine, because anyone can benefit from a good routine, there is no harm in it.  I'll keep looking for the other possible issues to the best of my ability. Crying so much is certainly an overreaction to a mere temporary loss of playthings.  Maybe the parents yell at him? He did say they don't hit him, and he doesn't want to disappoint his father...

Thankfully, no violent lash-outs have occurred at school.  However, according to his teacher, he said on numerous occasions that he hates math, English, science and I suppose every other subject, although he gets good grades.

I have not spoken to his parents yet; I am planning to do that tomorrow very carefully.  I have spoken to them over the phone on other issues and saw them around school passing by. Frankly, I am apprehensive of their reaction.  When I approached them on a minor administrative issue in the beginning of last school year, I got an unprovoked angry response.  I remembered it so well that I never approached them again.

What sort of questions do you think I can ask them?  I am thinking so far to go through the same questions that I asked the boy.  I'll also refrain from volunteering any categorical statements and avoid confrontation. Medication is not an option for us without professional involvement. I will also refrain from making any promises or assuming personal responsibility, based on the fact that I am not licensed and they don't want professional involvement.

I guess if the boy's parents were sweet, soft-spoken people, he wouldn't have had these problems to begin with.

I'll keep this forum updated.  I'll appreciate more input from you.

[soliro]

To S. Earl Martin:

Thank you for your clear categorization of my plan as being similar to mediation.  How do you think my approach differs from a standard mediation?

He absolutely needs a lot of attention, but only the constructive kind, which he likely has a problem getting at home. Verbal abuse cannot be ruled out and hopefully that is the primary and only underlying cause. He is only 12 and I cannot assess whether his level of maturity is appropriate for his developmental stage since I don't know what it should be. I'll check into his friendship circle for possible homework partners.

Thanks again.

[HeyItsRyan]

Thank you for your thoughtful reply.

To HeyItsRyan:

I wholeheartedly agree that the boy should be taken to a child psychiatrist.  This has been a standing recommendation from our school to his parents for at least the year that I've been working there.  The parents do not want to hear it.  Of course, we'll keep asking, and I'll make sure to mention it to them first when we meet in person.

As to the boy's reasons, I also doubt that it is forgetfulness. I haven't come out and said so to him, because I think that would be counter productive, but whether it's really forgetfulness or other issues, I had him work out a packing routine, because anyone can benefit from a good routine, there is no harm in it.  I'll keep looking for the other possible issues to the best of my ability. Crying so much is certainly an overreaction to a mere temporary loss of playthings.  Maybe the parents yell at him? He did say they don't hit him, and he doesn't want to disappoint his father...

Thankfully, no violent lash-outs have occurred at school.  However, according to his teacher, he said on numerous occasions that he hates math, English, science and I suppose every other subject, although he gets good grades.

I have not spoken to his parents yet; I am planning to do that tomorrow very carefully.  I have spoken to them over the phone on other issues and saw them around school passing by. Frankly, I am apprehensive of their reaction.  When I approached them on a minor administrative issue in the beginning of last school year, I got an unprovoked angry response.  I remembered it so well that I never approached them again.

What sort of questions do you think I can ask them?  I am thinking so far to go through the same questions that I asked the boy.  I'll also refrain from volunteering any categorical statements and avoid confrontation. Medication is not an option for us without professional involvement. I will also refrain from making any promises or assuming personal responsibility, based on the fact that I am not licensed and they don't want professional involvement.

I guess if the boy's parents were sweet, soft-spoken people, he wouldn't have had these problems to begin with.

I'll keep this forum updated.  I'll appreciate more input from you.

The fact that the boy's parents don't want professional help for him is a bad sign to me. Once you meet them, let me know what your impression is of them.

Naturally, every parent wants to do what is right for their child. If they notice a problem with their son but refuse to get him proper help, then they might be the reason behind the problems and are just protecting themselves.

I'm not saying there aren't other reasons, like financial trouble. But nonetheless, when it comes to children there is always a solution in this country. And because of that, the fact that they are avoiding proper help for their son is sketchy.

When it comes to abusive parents, either mentally or physically, the last thing they want is a psychiatrist probing around in their child's head asking questions.

[S. Earl Martin]

Soliro: Standard mediation is between two or more people. It is made clear no name calling or interupting. Each person starts out by stateing their view of the situation. I believe this. This is effecting me thus and so. It gives them a chance to express their opinions in a safe none threatening enviornment. Using open ended questions helps in this. How does it make you feel when this happens? How do you think this could be changed in a way that makes you feel better, but still resolves the problem. This is their positions.

After each person is finished. Then you move to possible solutions. Each person states possible solutions. After each person is satisfied that their possible solutions have been stated as a whole the possible solutions are discussed. This is where it gets give and take. This process can take sometime. It is important that the mediator doesn't take sides. That they stay neutral. It is very tempting to "help" the participants come to a decision, but if the agreement is going to work they need to be the ones to reach it. After words a contract is drawn up and all parties sign it.

You said that this is a religious school? There are mediatiors that are of different faiths. Or that are lawyers. Many will do the mediation pro bono in some cases. Or at a reduced fee. The religious aspect could be why the parents are reluctant to get professional help. Or it could be they are hiding something and don't want to be found out.

Mediations are strictly confidential and nothing discussed leaves the room. It can't be used in court. With the acception of if someone is in danger or being abused. Especially with children. People discuss all kind of things. Drug use, personal problems, financial issues, all kind of things come up, but it is necessary to resolve the problem.

If this is a Christian school or another religion it would be important to include scripture or quotes from any religious documentation or texts. This would tend to set the parants at ease if they are of the same faith. Usually it is best if the mediator isn't the one bringing the scriptures unless the scriptures are neutral.  Encourage the participants to be the ones to bring them is helpful. Although this can lead to a religious debate. If that is the heart of the problem then that can be good. I wish you peace and blessings. I will be praying for you Earl 

[soliro]

Quick update:
Got the boy off the bus today.  I asked him to rewrite the plan neatly over the weekend and checked his work today. He did his work only partially-not adding anything new and even skipping a lot of the old parts. So I sent him back with it saying to try again and add another way to stop crying by leaving the place where he got upset, going to the restroom and washing his face.  It was kind of rushed because my other work duties kept interfering and people came in and out.  He gave me a bit of an attitude when I was asking him questions.  He would only say "I don't have a pen" so first I clarified that I want a verbal answer, then I pointed to one of his problems on the list that he wrote himself last Friday - disrespect - and told him that I am experiencing it right now. Then he started answering questions.

If he doesn't do the rewriting properly again, then I'll just tell him that it is ok, since I only wanted it done so it makes a better impression on his teacher, the principal and his parents. Anyway, as we come to new agreements (hopefully!) with his parents, I'll be doing a lot of typing, and it will include parts of the boy's original. I don't want to enter into a battle of the wills with him so early on over this; another purpose of this was to make him think about his plans over the weekend, which was accomplished I think.

He did his regular homework, behaved in class today, and I heard another positive characteristic of him from his religious studies teacher.

I wrote the letter to his parents.  It is two pages and includes names, so I won't post it here. To summarize, it says that there is a problem, the boy has a plan, the school will support it, parents should too, if they don't, there are consequences and the school is not responsible for anything. The principal and the teacher approved the message, and I will make the phone call and mail the letter tomorrow.

Everyone has warned me at least once about the boy's father...

[HeyItsRyan]

Quick update:
Got the boy off the bus today.  I asked him to rewrite the plan neatly over the weekend and checked his work today. He did his work only partially-not adding anything new and even skipping a lot of the old parts. So I sent him back with it saying to try again and add another way to stop crying by leaving the place where he got upset, going to the restroom and washing his face.  It was kind of rushed because my other work duties kept interfering and people came in and out.  He gave me a bit of an attitude when I was asking him questions.  He would only say "I don't have a pen" so first I clarified that I want a verbal answer, then I pointed to one of his problems on the list that he wrote himself last Friday - disrespect - and told him that I am experiencing it right now. Then he started answering questions.

If he doesn't do the rewriting properly again, then I'll just tell him that it is ok, since I only wanted it done so it makes a better impression on his teacher, the principal and his parents. Anyway, as we come to new agreements (hopefully!) with his parents, I'll be doing a lot of typing, and it will include parts of the boy's original. I don't want to enter into a battle of the wills with him so early on over this; another purpose of this was to make him think about his plans over the weekend, which was accomplished I think.

He did his regular homework, behaved in class today, and I heard another positive characteristic of him from his religious studies teacher.

I wrote the letter to his parents.  It is two pages and includes names, so I won't post it here. To summarize, it says that there is a problem, the boy has a plan, the school will support it, parents should too, if they don't, there are consequences and the school is not responsible for anything. The principal and the teacher approved the message, and I will make the phone call and mail the letter tomorrow.

Everyone has warned me at least once about the boy's father...

Warned in what sense?

I've had bad vibes about the parents from the beginning, and my intuition is mostly right from my experience. You need to check the boys interactions with both men and women. He seems to listen to you and not act out as badly, but it could be because you're an adult male and he fears you. (Like his father, perhaps?)

Like I said before, I'd certainly like to know your impression of the parents, specifically the father, when you actually meet them. At this point in time I'd recommend you switch to a more direct approach with the boy. We need to rule out the parents as quickly as possible, so next time you see the boy the I recommend you ask at least one of the following questions:

1) How's everything going at home?
2) What did you, your mom and your dad do yesterday?
3) Who do you like more, mom or dad? And why?
4) What do you and your dad do for fun together?

It's important to pay attention to see if he's lying. Unlike adults, most 12 year olds aren't good liars so when they lie it should be easily detectable. Here's a few signs to look out for:

1) Studies show that if a person looks up and to their right then they're likely to be accessing the VC (Visually Constructed) side of their brains, indicating they're making up a lie. Down and to the right may indicate the same thing, depending on the complexity of the question asked.

2) Body language; Not looking you in the eyes, looking down, touching of the face, mouth, or neck are all proven signs of lying. They indicate the subject is nervous.

3) Changing questions; If you sense the boy is lying, specifically about the parents, change the subject immediately to something he can relate to (like video games) and immediately gauge his response. If the body language changes to immediately seem more relaxed, and he's less hesitant to answer video game questions then he likely lied to your last question.


The importance behind this is usually not what you would think. Abused children have a tendency to view their parents, or at least the abusive one, as untouchable. They don't fully understand that other people can help and can get the parent(s) to stop. Instead, they believe that if they told on their parents they would get in even more trouble BY their parents. Therefore, they continue to lie and protect the parents because they believe they are protecting themselves.



So try catching the boy off guard with a simple question about his parents and see what he does and says.

I await your response to this.

[soliro]

Here’s the latest:

Got all the signatures on the letter and called parents; got the father first. The conversation went fine at first, although he was not happy that he was not notified immediately that the boy missed some homework and got in trouble. He did not comment on the fact that the boy made his own plan. He agreed to make an appointment.

Then we came to the part where I ask him to wait with dispensing punishment until we all sit down, talk and agree what the punishment should be. He wasn’t going along. When I asked him what is going to happen tonight when the boy comes home, the answer was that his playthings are going to be taken away and he will spend the day in his room. I was trying to point out that this has failed to work previously, but he insisted that it works. He said that this is how his father punished him. It worked for him and it will work for his son because his son is a “carbon copy” of himself. Moreover, he discussed this with his son earlier and the boy knows that this will happen as soon as the parents get any bad news from school. He was talking a lot and it was very hard for me to get a word in. Next time I’ll just listen.

I tried to explain that we have to work together and work out a consistent system which the school can support. I also said that the school is supporting the boy’s plan, and will support any parental plans about which we come to an agreement, but we won’t be able to support plans with which there is no agreement.  That was a huge mistake on my part. I should have slowed down and just worked on other parts of the plan instead of trying to get the boy off the hook for tonight right away. The father took great offence to what I said. He said it is his right as a parent to decide this; that the school should work with him instead of trying to tell him what to do; that this is religious doctrine.

I am not too knowledgeable in religious doctrine, so my response was that I can invite our religious leader. (I am skipping religion-specific terminology on purpose here, same as with names and places.) That made things even worse.  He said that his father was a religious leader, so was his grandfather, and he has no wish to speak about doctrine to our current leader. 

I tried to save what I could, reminded him that we need to make an appointment and discuss it all in person as soon as possible and wrapped up the call.

Next think I know, the boy’s mother is sitting in the principal’s office, having a conversation with the principal’s assistant. I rushed to help but was told that she is here to speak to the principal only. After the mother wrapped up her conversation with the principal on her way out she asked to speak to me.

Predictably, she informed me that the conversation with the principal was about me, as I have offended the father and have no business butting in. Also, the boy is known for lying, manipulating, drawing attention to himself, soliciting pity and inciting drama, and the next time he is crying, I should call her to school as she knows exactly how to deal with this. She juxtaposed her two sons that go to our school and the 10yo one was clearly better. 

I confirmed that indeed it is none of my business- I was just trying to help, and apologized for offending as it was not my purpose. I said that I need to give her a few copies relevant to the business at hand and left her to cool off for a few minutes while I copied the boy’s plan and the school’s letter to parents. After giving her a minute to look through, I said that the school is now concerned a little less with homework and more with his inability to stop crying. I also brought up the fact that according to his 5th grade teacher all this started or got a lot worse 2 years ago when he was the only boy in class with several girls. She confirmed.  I again apologized and offered to remove myself from the situation, which offer she did not accept. I think that got her thinking in the other direction, because an hour later the boy’s teacher said that the mom showed up in class, spoke to the teacher, insisted that the boy gets no physical abuse and cried a little… I hope she did not do this in front of all the children.

The teacher also said that the mother asked for all hw assignments to be channeled through the younger brother, who is much more responsible. That is, every day the worksheets and a checklist of assignments will be sent home with the boy’s younger brother. This arrangement does not sit well with me, because I think it might aggravate the relationship between brothers and provide a constant source of humiliation, but I see no good way to object right now, as the boy has neither the teacher’s nor the parents’ trust. I suggested email, but not everything can be sent electronically.

I asked the principal about appropriate religious references for the case, but the principal dismissed these concerns. I suppose he has no problems quoting and referencing, but I’ll have to do some research before I can even mention any of that. The principal also mentioned that the father is known for being stubborn, and that he dislikes our religious leader. I wish I had that info a little earlier. The principal also knows the father’s father, and will try to contact him.

Tomorrow, I am planning to let the father or mother know that the principal, the teacher and I are all willing to stay after hours to accommodate the father’s work schedule and I’ll make that appointment. I’ll keep the conversation short and discuss nothing else over the phone. I want all interaction with the father happening in front of the principal from now on.


To HeyItsRyan:

Thank you for your thoughtful input and genuine interest. My impression of the parents is that they are people of strong faith, and their primary belief is in their own righteousness. I suspect that even if there is no outright abuse, there is too much pressure and not enough flexibility. I doubt that I’ll be able to change the parents, so I’ll try to work on making it look like every idea is their own enlightenment. I’ll do my best to get them thinking of improving their system of rewards and punishments. I’ll encourage the teacher to work with the parents on developing a dense system of checks for assignments and general progress.

Referral to a professional is a known point of contention.  I mentioned it in the official letter and I’ll mention it again when I am not arguing with the father, if the principal does not mention it first. Counseling for the boy would be free from the school district, although I don’t know what kind of specialists the district would provide.

I am a woman, and in fact the whole school is full of women teachers. The only adult males are the principal and the visiting parents, so it is hard to assess the boy’s interactions with men. Since all this trouble started when he was the only boy in a class full of girls, I suspect that there are untold depths to this side of the story.

I asked the boy how things go at home and he said that on a regular day he does not talk to his parents much. His mother works at home as a babysitter and is always busy. His father sometimes comes home as early as 3pm, but it isn’t clear what he does then. The boy shows his homework upon request. He did not seem to be lying; he was looking to the left. Normally he speaks to me with his eyes down, and glances up from time to time. He always seems to be very tense. Sometimes he is on the verge of crying-always with a tissue, wiping his nose, eyes glistening; sometimes he is nonresponsive-face blank, eyes glossy, replies terse.   I’ve only seen him relaxed when he is talking to other children. I forgot to ask which parent he likes more or what they do for fun… Let’s see if I get another opportunity.


To S. Earl Martin:

Thank you for your description of mediation practice.  I’ll try my best to keep to it, although it is indeed difficult not to steer toward a decision that I want to hear. I am not much of a debater in religion, but although it may make my position weaker as an advocate of change, it will also help me stay out of any arguments about this subject. Please keep praying for all of us.

[HeyItsRyan]

Religious doctrine? Religious leader?

Sorry, but I have to ask. Where do you live and what religion are we referring to? Personally, I am a man of science and do not follow a religious path. Far be it for me to question the beliefs of others, but from what I've seen in my life and through my experience, there have been far too many instances of children being raised incorrectly because of certain religious beliefs.

However, religion aside, the father is sounding more and more like a key issue to me and the mother certainly isn't help. The father obviously has a power/dominance issue, which seems to be a product of how he was raised himself, as he stated. I can wholeheartedly see this as being a child abuse issue. It's also suspicious that the mother came alone to the school and made it a point to tell the principal that her son regularly acts out, causes trouble, and cries, yet refuses to discuss proper treatment. I get the suspicion that she too is protecting the father by making the boy's behavior sound like a "normal" thing. That way, when the boy acts out in the future people won't be suspicious.

I'd hate to jump to conclusions based solely upon what you've told me over the Internet, but I am personally concerned for this boy now. Without saying anything else on his behavior, I can tell you that this is NOT normal and that the boy needs professional help and mediation.

But, let's say that despite all this talk nothing happens and things continue on as they are now. In that case, I recommend switching up your methods with the boy. Although the plan you made seems to be working slightly, I have a strong sense that the boy is punished way too often and needs some reward in his life. He NEEDS to know that he is a good, smart kid and that you recognize he is trying very hard, whether you believe he is or not. It's psychology 101, and this encouragement will make the boy strive harder to please you, his parents, his teachers and others.

I think he does have emotional problems, but when dealing with a child this unstable the last thing you want to do is just take, take, take. Try to discuss with the principal and primarily the parents the idea of implementing a reward system. Instead of punishing bad behavior, you should focus on rewarding good behavior. Find out what the boy likes and wants, thing both appropriate for home and school, and set goals for him so he can try to attain these rewards.

A good example for the parents would be, instead of taking away his toys when he acts up in school, they should simply let the boy know that what he did was not acceptable, then immediately change the subject to reward by saying something like, "What you did in class today was not acceptable and we are upset with you. However, if you work harder and do [whatever goal] and listen to your teacher, then we will get you the [new toy, game, etc.] that you saw the other day."

It's been studied, tried and tested and believe me when I say that positive trumps negative any day. Right now, I get the impression that the boy is just trying to skim by under the radar, primarily to stay out of trouble from the parents. He has absolutely nothing to look forward to, strive for, or dream about. His only goal is to apparently try and not lose things he already has. Give the boy a goal and something positive to look forward to and I guarantee you will see improvement.

This is a life skill that parents need to instill in their children at an early age, because this is what we, as adults, do when we get older. This why we go to college, because we know the reward is a better job, more money, etc. This is why we work hard at our jobs, because we know the reward is a promotion.

I hope this makes sense and that you change the plan accordingly. And, hopefully, the parents will quit being stubborn and stop relying on faith and instead move forward with a proven system for the benefit and well-being of their child.

If a 30-something year old man working at McDonald's flipping burgers, with no family, no girlfriend, living all alone in a rundown part of town and having no future is what they want for their son, then by all means tell them to keep doing what they're doing. But if they want to see their son graduate, go to college, get a great job, meet a great girl, have great kids, basically obtain the "American dream", then they need to STOP what they're doing immediately and change their ways before they push their own son too far.

Minds are a terrible thing to waste, and once they break there is usually no fixing them.

Good luck, to both you and the boy. I certainly feel sorry for him, as both a father, an educator and also someone who has personally experienced what it's like to have parents who just don't care. But seeing as I'm only 24 years old and have striven for so much in my own life, despite my upbringing, I can tell you that there is hope for the boy. Just keep trying.

[soliro]

First the update:
I spoke to the boy in the morning. He confirmed that he was punished yesterday just as the father described. He has nothing to say on the matter. He likes both his parents the same. For fun, he sometimes goes with his mom to the store, and with his dad to his job.

In the middle of the day, his religious studies teacher complained to the principal that the boy did not do his homework again for the umpteenth time. We could not come to an immediate solution to this, as calling home according to the classroom rules does nothing good. The principal suggested easier homework, although it is already not hard. The teacher said that all student planners should be checked and compared every day to make sure all assignments get copied down from the board. I suggested a class-wide weekly reward system. The principal said the boy likes to read, so books are good rewards. I offered some free treat coupons that I just ordered for the school. In the end we agreed that the system of rules and consequences has to be modified and left the details up to the teacher.

Later I called his home to remind them about making an appointment with the school. I spoke to mom who sounded haughty for about three seconds of the greeting and then very uncertain. She said that she will get back to me tomorrow after checking with her husband about his availability. She asked very reasonable common sense questions about timing and who is expected to be present. It was a polite and guarded conversation overall. I think she feels conflicted about her loyalties right now.

At the end of the day, another teacher said that I should watch out for the father, that I am in danger.  She was certain that he can be violent.  She said that 2 years ago she and another teacher saw him hit the boy, but her report was dismissed by the school authorities. I could not get all details from her because she had to leave, but I told her that I'd like to discuss this further.


To HeyItsRyan:

Your comments are very helpful. I read them in the morning and right away mentioned a reward system to the principal and one of the subject teachers.  I'll keep it up with his parents and classroom teacher too.

Like I mentioned in the very beginning, this is a religious school.  However, I am trying very hard to keep religion out of this.

I agree that the father has issues.  I am looking forward to meeting his own father as soon as possible, and I will remind the principal about arranging this.

I will for now keep an open mind and not accuse anyone of anything, neither abuse nor concealment. It is too easy for the family to simply relocate, taking the boy and all their problems to a place where no one knows them.

I am hoping to bring about a change for this boy, but for now I just feel tired. Tomorrow is another day.

[soliro]

Today the boy had a sore throat. His mom asked for him to be ready by 10am to go to a doctor and I walked him from class to office. He did not want to talk and just coughed pointedly back. As mom signed him out, I reminded her about making an appointment for a meeting. She feigned surprise and then updated me that the father spoke to the principal and there will be no meeting. From her tone I gathered that this was meant to scare me into thinking of losing my job. I tried to switch the topic and gave her our standard reminder to bring a doctor's note for school.  She caustically responded that they are experienced parents. This consistent unprovoked contentiousness only serves to raise my suspicions of abuse.

The principal confirmed that the conversation with the father took place early morning and called it an "effusion of hostility." He asked me not to call the parents anymore.  I reminded him to find the boy's grandfather, and he said he is looking.  I suggested that the school district may have some procedures for helping children without parental consent, and the principal asked me to find out more.

I let his teacher know that there will be no meeting or cooperation for lack of parental consent. She was disappointed and contrasted them with other parents that sign up for all help they can get and only wish they could get more. The classroom teacher now emails the mother lists of the boy's assignments, although separate subjects get missed because not all subject teachers are on board yet. He did not do his religious studies homework, but did everything else and even turned in a missing project. I encouraged her to report to his parents not only problems but more of the boy's successes and to keep it positive.

The teacher who witnessed possible physical abuse of the boy was absent today, so I will catch her tomorrow. The other witness does not work here anymore.

I will now look for legal advise, because lack of parental consent makes it a legal problem. Our state makes it mandatory for school administration to report reasonable suspicion of abuse and the boy may fall under physical abuse or emotional maltreatment.  However, before I report this, I have to make sure that my suspicions are legally reasonable and look into other possible courses of action.

[HeyItsRyan]

Today the boy had a sore throat. His mom asked for him to be ready by 10am to go to a doctor and I walked him from class to office. He did not want to talk and just coughed pointedly back. As mom signed him out, I reminded her about making an appointment for a meeting. She feigned surprise and then updated me that the father spoke to the principal and there will be no meeting. From her tone I gathered that this was meant to scare me into thinking of losing my job. I tried to switch the topic and gave her our standard reminder to bring a doctor's note for school.  She caustically responded that they are experienced parents. This consistent unprovoked contentiousness only serves to raise my suspicions of abuse.

The principal confirmed that the conversation with the father took place early morning and called it an "effusion of hostility." He asked me not to call the parents anymore.  I reminded him to find the boy's grandfather, and he said he is looking.  I suggested that the school district may have some procedures for helping children without parental consent, and the principal asked me to find out more.

I let his teacher know that there will be no meeting or cooperation for lack of parental consent. She was disappointed and contrasted them with other parents that sign up for all help they can get and only wish they could get more. The classroom teacher now emails the mother lists of the boy's assignments, although separate subjects get missed because not all subject teachers are on board yet. He did not do his religious studies homework, but did everything else and even turned in a missing project. I encouraged her to report to his parents not only problems but more of the boy's successes and to keep it positive.

The teacher who witnessed possible physical abuse of the boy was absent today, so I will catch her tomorrow. The other witness does not work here anymore.

I will now look for legal advise, because lack of parental consent makes it a legal problem. Our state makes it mandatory for school administration to report reasonable suspicion of abuse and the boy may fall under physical abuse or emotional maltreatment.  However, before I report this, I have to make sure that my suspicions are legally reasonable and look into other possible courses of action.

What state do you live in?

By all rights, it's not your responsibility to have "reasonable" suspicion. You're not a qualified expert in this type of thing. Leave it to DCF to determine if there's reasonable suspicion, as your suspicion in general should be good enough to get outside involvement.

Hopefully, all the interaction you and the school has had with the parents over the last week will at least show them that they are being watched. And if there IS any type of foul play involved from the parents that it ceases immediately.

I can definitely tell you that when a school reports suspicious activity and even HINTS at child abuse, the state will be all over it. However, if the school itself remains unconvinced and refuses to report their suspicions, then YOU still have every right to do so, and you may do it anonymously as well. Whether the state takes it as seriously is another matter, but at least you tried for the boy's sake.

Don't give up on the subject just because the parents want to play hard ball. And if the boy does anything else that seems unusual, let me know.

Also, remember to keep pushing positive reinforcement as well.

[S. Earl Martin]

I would urge caution about abuse. In abuse cases it requires what is known as an outcry statement from the alleged victim. This statement should not be coerced. This can lead to false accusations. Especially where authority is involved.

It is possible that the parants are just suspicious of authority. Any authority. This is common with religious groups today. This is why some parents choose religious schools in the first place.

Soliro: I am only going off what you have written, but I don not see any evidence of abuse. If the child hasn't mentioned it? Caution should be taken so not to make false accusations that could make the stituation much worse. Or lead to a law suit against the school or even the people involved.

Personally I believe the child is acting out. They want attention and are doing what they see as the path to get it. The fact that so many people are paying attention now could be just reinforceing the negative behavior. If they continue to not comply with the demands it would be evidence that this is the case. Could just be the childs way of rebelling against authority.
Peace.

[HeyItsRyan]

I would urge caution about abuse. In abuse cases it requires what is known as an outcry statement from the alleged victim. This statement should not be coerced. This can lead to false accusations. Especially where authority is involved.

It is possible that the parants are just suspicious of authority. Any authority. This is common with religious groups today. This is why some parents choose religious schools in the first place.

Soliro: I am only going off what you have written, but I don not see any evidence of abuse. If the child hasn't mentioned it? Caution should be taken so not to make false accusations that could make the stituation much worse. Or lead to a law suit against the school or even the people involved.

Personally I believe the child is acting out. They want attention and are doing what they see as the path to get it. The fact that so many people are paying attention now could be just reinforceing the negative behavior. If they continue to not comply with the demands it would be evidence that this is the case. Could just be the childs way of rebelling against authority.
Peace.

S. Earl Martin:

I honestly believe that a lawsuit is not on the table right now. There's no way a judge or a jury would go against the school when it's technically their job to not only educate, but also look out for the well-being of these kids. If the boy were going to a public school and was acting out like this, they simply would not tolerate it. Like I said earlier, the school doesn't need anymore evidence than they already have to call DCF and open a case. And let's review the evidence at hand:

1) A witness who already saw possible physical abuse.
2) Multiple staff members, including soliro, who are weary of the father.
3) Parents refusing to accept the school's intervention.
4) Parents refusing to cooperate and seek professional help for the boy.
5) The boy is showing unnatural signs of distrust and mental instability for his age (not normal compared to his classmates).


I don't believe the child is simply acting out for attention. It seems slightly more complicated than that. My three year old is more well behaved than this boy seems to be. Like I said in one of my first posts, this could very well be ADHD. But only a professional can diagnose and treat that, which the parents refuse to see.

In order to say that the boy is simply acting out for attention, you'd have to imply that he is doing all of this on purpose and that deep down, he knows better. Well, I don't think this is the case.


For soliro's sake, here are the signs of ADHD.

Signs of inattentiveness caused by ADHD:

- Often fails to pay close attention to details or makes careless mistakes in schoolwork or other activities
- Often has trouble sustaining attention during tasks or play
- Seems not to listen even when spoken to directly
- Has difficulty following through on instructions and often fails to finish schoolwork, chores or other tasks
- Often has problems organizing tasks or activities
- Avoids or dislikes tasks that require sustained mental effort, such as schoolwork or homework
- Frequently loses needed items, such as books, pencils, toys or tools
- Can be easily distracted
- Often forgetful

Signs of hyperactive/compulsive behavior caused by ADHD:

- Fidgets or squirms frequently
- Often leaves his or her seat in the classroom or in other situations when remaining seated is expected
- Often runs or climbs excessively when it's not appropriate or, if an adolescent, might constantly feel restless
- Frequently has difficulty playing quietly
- Always seems on the go
- Talks excessively
- Blurts out the answers before questions have been completely asked
- Frequently has difficulty waiting for his or her turn
- Often interrupts or intrudes on others' conversations or games


Point in case, whether caused by the parents or not, the boy's behavior is not normal. Possible ADHD? Definitely; Possible mental abuse at home which is causing the boy to act out like this? Possibly.

I've been swinging more towards ADHD from the start, but the parents ARE a problem too. Children don't just get rid of ADHD if they truly have it. It grows with them, and when they become adults they'll act out in the same ways. And although an adult could control it better, it's still no way to live.

The parents obviously see a problem in their boy, since the school is as involved as they are, but they refuse to do anything about it. Most people would assume this is because they're hiding something.


@soliro:

In addition to what I've told you, here are a few articles you can read just for yourself, so at least you'll see I'm not accusing the parents for no reason:

Psychological and Religious Abuse of Children:
http://openparachute.wordpress.com/2008/04/27/psychological-and-religious-abuse-of-children/

"Christian" Child Abuse:
http://www.nospank.net/fortune.htm

Religious Parents and Atheist Children:
http://atheism.about.com/b/2009/04/07/comment-of-the-week-religious-parents-atheist-children.htm

There's also a book out now entitled, Breaking Their Will: Shedding Light on Religious Child Maltreatment, which you can get a little information on here:
http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2011/06/18/shedding-light-on-religious-child-maltreatment/


I certainly don't want anyone, specifically soliro, to think I'm judging this whole thing based on religion. Because I'm not. But soliro's past reference to "religious leaders" truly has me believing that we are talking about a cult or religious sect here.

See, in Christian faith a "religious leader" would be like the Father/priest in the church you attend. And last I checked, most Christian's don't run off to church to ask the priest his opinion on everything that happens with their children.

[soliro]

Update:

Today the boy was absent. Parents sent a doctor’s note to teacher through the boy’s younger brother.

I spoke to the TA who saw the boy being hit two years ago, and here’s the story:

It was after dismissal, and the boy climbed onto the roof of the playground set.  The two TAs on their way from one building to another saw him, told him to get down, gave him a lecture and sent him to his dad whom they could see in the parking lot.  They let the father know what happened.  The father said to the boy “Wait until we get home, you’ll see what happens,” and took the boy to the car. When the TAs got to the door, one of them looked back and called to the other “Look what is happening!” They both stood and watched as inside the car the father punched the boy in the face. The boy’s head hit the glass. The car door opened slightly.  Then the door was pulled shut and the father punched the kid again.  The boy’s head hit the glass again.  Then the car quickly pulled out of parking and left “with tires screeching.” The TAs reported this to the vice principal who seemed dismissive. One TA also went to the principal. It is not clear whether any report was filed. Certainly none was filed by the TA that is now on staff, or the principal, or the vice principal who no longer works here. The TA that is no longer on staff may have reported it anonymously. Going to the vice principal was a mistake because he turned out to be a friend of the boy’s father.

What a can of worms.

 I took this story to my direct supervisor as the principal was too busy today. She advised me against reporting any of this as the TA is well known for exaggerating, there are no clear signs of abuse such as bruises, the principal will never stand up to the family and all this is just a cultural thing that is quite acceptable abroad.

Her culture must be quite the same.

I now believe that I will report this one way or another. I’ll go to the principal with this, who will probably stall for time and try to let it slide. I am rather angry now that I see that the whole system works very well to cover such stories up. If I get no official support from school, I will probably report this anonymously and lose my job. Hooray. Never mind, I’ll find a way.


To HeyItsRyan:

We are in NY. I now have more than a reasonable suspicion, and this is going straight to the proper authorities. 

Boy VS ADHD:

- Often fails to pay close attention to details or makes careless mistakes in schoolwork or other activities        – no evidence
- Often has trouble sustaining attention during tasks or play     – no evidence
- Seems not to listen even when spoken to directly          – he does listen
- Has difficulty following through on instructions and often fails to finish schoolwork, chores or other tasks         – he performs fine in class, except when he argues with teachers
- Often has problems organizing tasks or activities       – only when it comes to hw, but not in class
- Avoids or dislikes tasks that require sustained mental effort, such as schoolwork or homework     - true
- Frequently loses needed items, such as books, pencils, toys or tools         - only hw assignments
- Can be easily distracted         - no evidence
- Often forgetful        - that is the boy’s chief voiced complaint

Signs of hyperactive/compulsive behavior caused by ADHD:
 
The boy is the opposite of hyperactive much of the time.

- Fidgets or squirms frequently      - he does not
- Often leaves his or her seat in the classroom or in other situations when remaining seated is expected         - false
- Often runs or climbs excessively when it's not appropriate or, if an adolescent, might constantly feel restless        - no evidence
- Frequently has difficulty playing quietly        - true
- Always seems on the go             - false
- Talks excessively      - very false
- Blurts out the answers before questions have been completely asked       - way off. He hardly talks (to figures of authority).
- Frequently has difficulty waiting for his or her turn       - no evidence
- Often interrupts or intrudes on others' conversations or games       - no evidence

BTW, I assure you that we are of a very mainstream religion that in no way condones any form of abuse. Of course it might be that the boy’s parents have a different interpretation.  Probably that is why they dislike our community leader.


To S. Earl Martin:

There is no outcry, but after checking the state guidelines I don’t think that an outcry is required. I will try to be cautious for my own and my family’s sake. The parents are certainly suspicious of authority and now they are concentrating on me so that I feel somewhat threatened.

According to DCF guidelines, no direct evidence such as bruises is required. However, there is now a witness. If a law suit comes, it might be more about why the school did not report this earlier.

The child was actually mostly compliant. It’s the parents who are signally not.

[HeyItsRyan]

soliro:

I, too, live in NY. Upstate, in a city called Plattsburgh. Although I'm sure you already know, here's the website for NYS CPS:

http://www.ocfs.state.ny.us/main/cps/

I'm going to send you a private message, so check your inbox.

[soliro]

Yes, thank you for the link, I have already been going through the materials there.

[S. Earl Martin]

Yes there is a marked difference between a swat on the butt and being punched in the face. If witnesses saw this, it very well could mean the child is in danger. As I stated earlier I was physically abused and used to be disruptive to avoid being abused. This could be the case here, The child might be afraid to actually say he is being abused, so he is acting out. It is his only precieved avenue of safety. The actions I would do didn't really help and in many ways they made the situation worse, but as a child I didn't realize this. I just was desperate.

As far as an outcry? If the child does give an outcry it is important that it is done correctly. If this does go to court for any reason? The outcry can be dismissed if it even appears coerced. That would potentially put the child back in the hands of the abuser. One thing that is important is to have witnesses to the outcry. If just one person hears it, it can be dismissed.

The issue of freedom of religion and the raising of children is a very difficult one. Some of the most difficult mediations I am aware of revolved around this. When you have extremists it becomes even more difficult. I am a Christian and today there is alot of "God told me thus and so" going on. False prophets are all over the place. If people would actually bother to read their Bible it would be plane that it is lies and deception, but they believe whatever they want and think just because they follow a religion God speaks directly to them. Many religious groups prefer to not get the authorities involved. They prefer to handle it in house. Or to pretend the problem doesn't exist.

You could report the abuse anonymously. This would require the Child Protective Services to at least talk with the child and to the parents. If abuse is suspected the parents could be required to attend parenting classes. Or if there is an outcry more severe action could be taken.