Girl trouble: ideas anyone?

[ConsciousPuppet]

I met this girl in my martial arts class. She exhibits low self esteem but I like her personality. She seems very sincere and has a way of being cute that she doesn’t know. A couple of weeks ago she invited me to the movies with some friends. We had a good time. I invited her over a while after and we talked for hours. Last night we went out just to walk and talk. We talked a lot and every time I said that we should go se said “nooooouuuu, cmon” in a way that implies “I don’t want you to go”. I understand and even she tells me that she is interested and wants to know me better, but she is afraid that (because she’s gotten to know my psychologist side a lot) I will get bored of her in the future and “kick her out”.

I know…
She feels ugly, she doesn’t think a guy would want something like her. Complains about her face, eyes, hands, feet, fat, height, hair, whiteness. She thinks she has a shitty, crappy and boring personality. Basically that she’s boring. Meaning people would not take interest in her.

I think…
I talked to her because she seemed like a person who would listen and think, and also cuz I wanted to help her feel better about herself. Also cuz I see her as a woman, even tho she’s 15 and im 21.

She thinks…
I’m an interesting person and likes to listen to me talk. Thinks I use people as entertainment and throw them away when I get bored.

I fear…
That she wont allow me to like her as a woman because of her belief that she is not what a man would want.

Why am I attracted to her? Why not girls my age? I don’t feel like talking to a woman just cause she looks good. I don’t respect my self when I want to be with someone based on how they look because it tells me nothing on how they truly are. Maybe I believe strongly that looks are deceitful. I need to see past appearances to feel interested, even tho I use interest appeal as an opener. Maybe she is confused because she cant tell when I show real interest and when I just impulsively smile and laugh (because I sometimes do, not just her, with everyone).

Any ideas are useful plz =]

[SWM]

i am taking this as the key statement of where you are stuck.

That she wont allow me to like her as a woman because of her belief that she is not what a man would want.

how can she not allow you to like her? if you like her, you like her? she cannot stop you? if you are consistent with that she will take it for what it is, eventually. by thinking like this you are buying in to her fears.  you are colluding with her to maintain her fear.

[Jazzy]

Well..I have a loved one(gal) who used to feel alot more LOW of herself till i intervened n boosted her morale..now,she is feeling alot better after she realised someone somwhere is interested in me for n who iam..
Some women are fine with/without love..But,esp gals of youth,tend to feel low purely based on their physical looks,thinking guys wont like and i wudnt have friends..
If you like her,dont quit..Make her believe by being natural that u really care for her and u love/like the way she is without condescending.
Love can break any lock..

Jazz

[dandan7926]

I can not bear it !!!!!!
Why I must  return here ,often often often often oftenoften 

[SWM]

any advance on the situation so far?

[ConsciousPuppet]

Oh right!

Its been like 5 days, and we�ve been able to spend a good amount of time together. She hasn�t been rejecting my interest and actually seems into it herself =]. I was just talking to her on msn and well meet tomorrow =]�

I decided after talking to you guys and to a close friend of mine that I would just be natural about it and to focus on what I wanted instead of what I didn�t.  I believe I like her enough to continue a better established relationship so step by step im gonna get there�

Things are looking up =]
Many thanks n gratutudes guys XD

[Jazzy]

hope to hear from ya soon!! :-)

[Enigma]

even tho she�s 15 and im 21.

Nuthin but heartache down that road.  

[squid]

even tho she�s 15 and im 21.

Nuthin but heartache down that road.  

I concur, the situation is no bueno. I recommend you scuttle any plans for operations in that theater and retreat. [/military lingo]

[ConsciousPuppet]

giving up already? heh

[voodoo scientist]

A 15 year old isn't yet rigged to competently select a mate, and as such has no ability to judge whether or not you are suitable. Whatever insecurity it is that makes you feel someone with that characteristic is the most suitable mate, learn to get over it. You're disgusting whether you have sex with her right away or wait till she's old enough and spend the waiting time getting her emotionally invested, and if you succeed at establishing a relationship with her, you will impede her normal development.

You sound like a textbook pedophile in the making in the original post. Insecure older guy meets even more insecure puberty girl, so Insecure Older Guy can forget about his own insecurities by focusing on Even More Insecure Puberty Girl's insecurities. It is impossible to have a mutually beneficial relationship with someone who has not yet formed their personality and range of competences, or fully formed their brain for that matter. It is always one-way.

[Karaten]

Now, I am not one to preach moral ideologies nor am I one to care, however, there are a few things you should note. Firstly, a girl at the age of 15 does not have her inhibition fully developed, therefore, it will be entirely your responsibility to to manage such things. Secondly, the ability to give consent in a rational and full-meaning way is hindered in this situation, and despite there being many legal situations of a similar state, this one is considered wrongful and thus illegal.  Finally, it will probably have an adverse and negative effect on your relationship with everyone else.

[voodoo scientist]

"Yes, voodoo, I agree with that" works just as well and saves you a lot of typing.

[ConsciousPuppet]

Hey guys, how bout some feedback:
I�ve been doing a looooooooot of thinking this few weeks [especially this weekend]

     I don�t mind society calling me a pedo, because I know what it means and I know myself, and the descriptions don�t fit together. Only those who care and ask will get an explanation.
    I don�t mind people calling me insecure. Again, only those who care and ask will get an explanation.
I don�t care for people who call me disgusting, they already don�t care bout me, so why should I care bout them?
     I understand people enjoy putting others down, seeing others fail, and that some don�t know how to say what they think without hurting others.

    People act as if she [15 years old] wont ever grow up� which is kinda funny to me. She is in the age of finding  identity and direction for her life [in the sense of occupation]. How is having a relationship [particularly with someone older and with more life experience in general, instead of someone her age and less �mature�] is going to impede her growth. It should instead provide experience. I don�t expect her to love me forever right now, because she is still developing her �self�, and may change in the future.

     Then everybody must be asking �if you know it might not last, if you understand how hard it will be, both legally and personally, why are you doing it?�. Its simple actually. I�m a very sociable guy, but I don�t find women who I like often, people who I feel affinity with. So if I like her, why would I give up? Just cause life isn�t as easy as we expect it to be?
     As I said, I like her and I don�t expect she to like me forever, but if she does it will make me happy�

PS: Please keep your self-belief assuring commentaries in your heads, not in my posts, ty =]

[Karaten]

"Yes, voodoo, I agree with that" works just as well and saves you a lot of typing.

Well, ignoring your mis definition of pedophile I suppose so.

in the sense of occupation]. How is having a relationship

I honestly don't see the allure. Sure, I understand the base desire to satisfy ones sexual desires and I'm sure it feels wonderful when you can ignore every other function of that part of the body as well as the unpredictability of how another person treats the rest of their body, including nose picking and adventurous touching of odd materials along with hygienic habits, nonetheless, it does not seem worth it to me. 

[ConsciousPuppet]

Seems i screwed up at posting, here it goes again:

Hey guys, how bout some feedback:
I’ve been doing a looooooooot of thinking this few weeks [especially this weekend]

I don’t mind society calling me a pedo, because I know what it means and I know myself, and the descriptions don’t fit together. Only those who care and ask will get an explanation.

I don’t mind people calling me insecure. Again, only those who care and ask will get an explanation.
I don’t care for people who call me disgusting, they already don’t care bout me, so why should I care bout them?
I understand people enjoy putting others down, seeing others fail, and that some don’t know how to say what they think without hurting others.
People act as if she [15 years old] wont ever grow up… which is kinda funny to me. She is in the age of finding  identity and direction for her life [in the sense of occupation]. How is having a relationship [particularly with someone older and with more life experience in general, instead of someone her age and less “mature”] is going to impede her growth. It should instead provide experience. I don’t expect her to love me forever right now, because she is still developing her “self”, and may change in the future.

Then everybody must be asking “if you know it might not last, if you understand how hard it will be, both legally and personally, why are you doing it?”. Its simple actually. I’m a very sociable guy, but I don’t find women who I like often, people who I feel affinity with. So if I like her, why would I give up? Just cause life isn’t as easy as we expect it to be?
As I said, I like her and I don’t expect she to like me forever, but if she does it will make me happy…

PS: Please keep your self-belief assuring commentaries in your heads, not in my posts, ty =]

[SWM]

strange! we seem to have lost some data from this thread.

i definitely remember reading CP's post and then Enigma, Squid  and Karatens response to that post.

however it seems to have gone missing, i will have to check the back up of the database i made when working on the forum yesterday.

[Turion]

Ok, so I managed to restore the missing data.

[sagarika]

there may be lots of trouble but nyhe most simple trouble is that what is she wearing at all is matching or not, is she looking good ...?

[ConsciousPuppet]

im not sure if i follow the question? do u mean if i like how she looks? I definitively do

[love]

explain her.. give her some time.. and tell her tat u ll wait too.. try twice and then jus quit..

[C0rnholio]

Well, what happened? Are you still together? Did you do it?

[ConsciousPuppet]

well guys, things are going swell, trust in the relationship has grown exponentially and so has interest, so a week ago we decided we would become boyfiriends[ if thats how u call it] "officially". =DD

the thing i like most about the relationship is that we are quick to clear up misunderstandings and open to express our true feelings in a constructive way. I think this only makes the relationship more stable.

tnx everybody for your advice and criticism

btw, if u're curious, i thought id be interesting if u could stick a head to my name, since i havent been able to upload my pic here:

http://www.myspace.com/consciouspuppet

[Enigma]

I find it disturbing that you are dating a 15 year old and have a picture of pedobear in your myspace pics. 

[C0rnholio]

Good luck. Just make sure to always use a condom. Else you will regret this relationship for the rest of your life.

[drywaterdrywater]

umm dont you think 15 is a little too old? i think 12 is about right for a 21 yr old your like sammy sosa playing teeball. have fun with that